Elt - save life?

[larrym 1]

Ok Ed, I picking on you;

"Single-place planes do not require them, although I would want one from the time of first flight - it could save your life."

I rather doubt that an ELT will saving anyone's life, especially on a local test flight. Your sounding like a polition who saw an airplane once in his life and is now setting laws to protect us.

You want a life saver - try fuel in the tank along with oil, fly on nice days only, do through walk arounds, never do anything for the "thrill", and so on! a 4 lb brick of electronic gear that the satilites don't pick up, and those who hear it on121.5 ignore it. I can get the exact statistic if you'd like, but nearly 98% of elt activations are false alarms - how does that affect the notification and response system...... I could go on, but I won't. I'm surprised by your remark.

All in good fun Ed :beerchug:/>/>/>

- fights on :hammerhead:/>/>/>

larry

[High Country 69]

Seeing as its just been brought up. is there a specific requirement for an ELT on these birds. I plan to use some sort of a PLB or a SPOT as they are more up to date and if needed I believe they would do more good than an outdated ELT. That said I will have one regardless of what is required but do I still need to pack on the extra weight of an old school ELT and if so what are the requirements for having the ability to activate it from the cockpit? and for replacing the battery. I bought this one a while back because it is completely self contained and pretty light, but to mount it in a place out of the way I will not be able to activate manually from the seat. thoughts? use it, toss it, use a different one? I also have an Artex 200 that could be mounted further aft and still be manually activated from the panel but its a LOT heavier than the one in the pic

-Robert-

Edited 16 Jan 2013 by High Country

[larrym 1]

Seeing as its just been brought up. is there a specific requirement for an ELT on these birds. I plan to use some sort of a PLB or a SPOT as they are more up to date and if needed I believe they would do more good than an outdated ELT. That said I will have one regardless of what is required but do I still need to pack on the extra weight of an old school ELT and if so what are the requirements for having the ability to activate it from the cockpit? and for replacing the battery. I bought this one a while back because it is completely self contained and pretty light, but to mount it in a place out of the way I will not be able to activate manually from the seat. thoughts? use it, toss it, use a different one? I also have an Artex 200 that could be mounted further aft and still be manually activated from the panel but its a LOT heavier than the one in the pic

-Robert-

I use the same elt, as I believe it is still legal, and mine was free. I also understand that the regulations have not kept up with technology, and though it be far better than the legal. Unfotunately, you have to be safe and legal. Safe with your spot, legal with the old elt....

I have a current battery date on mine, but can assure you that mine will never go off in the hangar in the middle of the night. (or ever)

larry

[ChrisBolkan 130]

Seeing as its just been brought up. is there a specific requirement for an ELT on these birds. I plan to use some sort of a PLB or a SPOT as they are more up to date and if needed I believe they would do more good than an outdated ELT. That said I will have one regardless of what is required but do I still need to pack on the extra weight of an old school ELT and if so what are the requirements for having the ability to activate it from the cockpit? and for replacing the battery. I bought this one a while back because it is completely self contained and pretty light, but to mount it in a place out of the way I will not be able to activate manually from the seat. thoughts? use it, toss it, use a different one? I also have an Artex 200 that could be mounted further aft and still be manually activated from the panel but its a LOT heavier than the one in the pic

-Robert-

I have the very ELT in your picture. It resides on the sidewall in the baggage compartment below the side window. Never has an inspection mention a problem with the location. it can be activated from the cockpit, but not without undoing seatbelt and turning around. Certainly I could not activate it easily while flying. Am I asking for trouble?

Chris

[akflyer 1427]

I have had occasion to use the 121 ELT twice. Both times I was glad to have had it. I have one in my plane now and use the SPOT if I need help. But the SPOT wont go off in the event that I am twisted up in the wreckage and cant manually hit it. Atleast I have a half a chance of the 121 going off and someone maybe eventually finding me.

Yes, maybe if I flew higher I would have time to activate the spot before I hit the ground and get atleast one message out, but alas, I dont. On the average I probly have 5-10 seconds to try a restart and find the softest spot to try and crash

[horsepower 24]

If your plane has not been inspected yet for a air worthiness then you have to have the new style with the remote control,it can still be 121.5.If it already has a airworthiness from a few years back then you can use the older style without the remote control.There is no rules as where you mount it but most mount behind seat.If you have a single place a elt is not required.I guess if you go down by yourself nobody cares.Randy

[High Country 69]

If your plane has not been inspected yet for a air worthiness then you have to have the new style with the remote control,it can still be 121.5.If it already has a airworthiness from a few years back then you can use the older style without the remote control.There is no rules as where you mount it but most mount behind seat.If you have a single place a elt is not required.I guess if you go down by yourself nobody cares.Randy

So what if I installed the Aritex 200 w remote switch get my inspection then replace with the other to loose the weight

[EDMO 1078]

Ok Ed, I picking on you;

"Single-place planes do not require them, although I would want one from the time of first flight - it could save your life."

I rather doubt that an ELT will saving anyone's life, especially on a local test flight. Your sounding like a polition who saw an airplane once in his life and is now setting laws to protect us.

You want a life saver - try fuel in the tank along with oil, fly on nice days only, do through walk arounds, never do anything for the "thrill", and so on! a 4 lb brick of electronic gear that the satilites don't pick up, and those who hear it on121.5 ignore it. I can get the exact statistic if you'd like, but nearly 98% of elt activations are false alarms - how does that affect the notification and response system...... I could go on, but I won't. I'm surprised by your remark.

All in good fun Ed :beerchug:/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>

Thanks for all the lifesaving tips - which I intend to follow to the letter - But I will still carry my "Brick" for more insurance - and why not have it in there when you do your W&B, since you will have to put it in to be legal as soon as you carry a passenger. NO, the PLB is not legal - but nice addition. I also carry the PL Strobe too.

And please note that I said "I would want one" - I am not making rules for everyone else!

Now you got me on the pulpit - so hear a bit of preaching!

I flew Search & Rescue for CAP/USAF for 11 years before ELTs were manditory - and believe me, when you find bodies - especially babies - around a plane that went down a week or two before, it is not a pretty sight - and you go to bed at night wondering if you had just spent another 5 or 15 minutes looking for them if someone might have lived,

and you pray that your injured body might be found before you die in the same situation - I would carry 2 ELTS if it gave me better odds of staying alive.

The ELT/Satelite system is far more reliable than the old search and search and search and recover we used to try to do.

Most of Missouri is what we call a "walk-out" state - you either walk out, or pray that your ELT is working and someone is coming soon!

Then again, if I really want to be safe - just sit at home in front of the boob-tube and rock away my lifetime!

Good Flying

ED in MO

Edited 17 Jan 2013 by Ed In Missouri

[ChrisBolkan 130]

If your plane has not been inspected yet for a air worthiness then you have to have the new style with the remote control,it can still be 121.5.If it already has a airworthiness from a few years back then you can use the older style without the remote control.There is no rules as where you mount it but most mount behind seat.If you have a single place a elt is not required.I guess if you go down by yourself nobody cares.Randy

Thanks Randy,

My airworthyness cert was issued with the ELT in the configuration I described, so it must be "legal"!

Chris

[ChrisBolkan 130]

It seems to me the new GPS 406 ELTs are absolutely the way to go. I still haven't taken the plunge. While expensive, I think one of those would be a FAR better last line of defence that a 121 Mhz ELT. I currently carry the small ELT in Robert's picture above and I have been carrying a spot for a couple of years too. Seems like I should bite the bullet and go 406.

Chris

[EDMO 1078]

ame='Ed In Missouri' date='16 January 2013 - 03:26 PM' timestamp='1358378814' post='10060']

It seems to me the new GPS 406 ELTs are absolutely the way to go. I still haven't taken the plunge. While expensive, I think one of those would be a FAR better last line of defence that a 121 Mhz ELT. I currently carry the small ELT in Robert's picture above and I have been carrying a spot for a couple of years too. Seems like I should bite the bullet and go 406.

Chris

I got a new expensive 406 instead of a real cheap 121.5 because my life is worth more than a "bargain" that dont get the job done - when shit hits the fan you dont worry about money!

My battery will have to be replaced by the time my plane is inspected, but flying is not cheap - my life isnt either!

ED in MO

[EDMO 1078]

Lets say that an ELT is good to have - But nothing is guaranteed to be a sure thing - another story follows:

A fairly new pilot, friend of mine, flew his Stintson from Birchwood across Cook Inlet to around Lake Clark -

On his return, he encountered such headwinds that he would have run out of gas over the water, so he chose to try to land instead. He ended up in a tangled wreck and pinned inside the plane with broken bones and cuts - and in freezing weather.

Soon afterward, the Coast Guard followed his ELT signal to the wreck and hovered above the plane looking for survivors. He said he heard the guy in the door of the chopper yell, "There's nobody here", and they were going to leave, he thought.

He managed to throw a gas can out of the window and they immediately came to his rescue.

Later, in the hospital, he told this story to me.

ED in MO

[SuberAvid 617]

I used my older ACK 121.5 ELT until they finally got the new ACK 406 on the market. It was about $600, still a chunk of money but not $1000 like most of the others.

[EDMO 1078]

I used my older ACK 121.5 ELT until they finally got the new ACK 406 on the market. It was about $600, still a chunk of money but not $1000 like most of the others.

Me Too - but the thing I hated to see was the cheap "D" batteries being replaced with a new, probably Lithium, more expensive 5 year battery - and with the Boeing batteries now catching on fire,

I wonder if my ELT will burn up too!

If I still had one of the light-weight 121 transmitters in my plane, I would leave it there and add the 406 for more insurance.

ED in MO

[SuberAvid 617]

Me Too - but the thing I hated to see was the cheap "D" batteries being replaced with a new, probably Lithium, more expensive 5 year battery - and with the Boeing batteries now catching on fire,

I wonder if my ELT will burn up too!

If I still had one of the light-weight 121 transmitters in my plane, I would leave it there and add the 406 for more insurance.

ED in MO

If I remember correctly, the new ACK 406 transmits on both 406 and 121.5. Probably most of them do.

[EDMO 1078]

If I remember correctly, the new ACK 406 transmits on both 406 and 121.5. Probably most of them do.

Yes, you are correct on that - But why not keep a second one since you probably wont get much for it anyway? You never know what may happen in an accident.

ED

Edited 18 Jan 2013 by Ed In Missouri

[Av8r_Sed 82]

Me Too - but the thing I hated to see was the cheap "D" batteries being replaced with a new, probably Lithium, more expensive 5 year battery - and with the Boeing batteries now catching on fire,

I wonder if my ELT will burn up too!

If I still had one of the light-weight 121 transmitters in my plane, I would leave it there and add the 406 for more insurance.

ED in MO

Check out this link if you want to see a deep fried Dreamliner LiIon battery. No need for a cabin heater with one of these babies on board.

All Nippon 787 Battery Article

[akflyer 1427]

Check out this link if you want to see a deep fried Dreamliner LiIon battery. No need for a cabin heater with one of these babies on board.

All Nippon 787 Battery Article

That goes along with my use of the LI batteries in the RC planes. When used in low draw applications they were fine, but if you pull too many amps at once, boom! the fire ball out of a little 1020ma AA size battery was pretty impressive (and made my little electric tigermoth look like it just got hit by the red barron (and that was pulling a little less than one amp on that plane) I now use LYPO batteries in all my RC planes and while they will catch fire if you seriously pull too many amps, they don't explode the way the LI batteries did. The LYPO batteries will puff up then the foil wrapper will break and you get a cute gas cloud then a slow fire that burns pretty hot once it gets started, but it is a slow motion process, not the sudden catastrophic boom and fire ball that a LI battery does.

Why Boeing would use LI batteries when there are SO MUCH better batteries out there now is beyond me.

[SuberAvid 617]

I think I'll let my Boing R&D team work on the LI battery issue for little while longer before I put one in my plane. :hammerhead:src="http://www.avidfoxflyers.com/public/style_emoticons/default/hammerhead.gif">

[EDMO 1078]

I think I'll let my Boing R&D team work on the LI battery issue for little while longer before I put one in my plane. :hammerhead:src="http://www.avidfoxflyers.com/public/style_emoticons/default/hammerhead.gif">

I think I will stay with the 680 battery and tell the wife to lose 10 or 100 pounds!

Ed in MO