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Jim, I'll look tonight.

Chris, I concur. There is a LOT of plumbing etc. on this engine even without your style carb heat. Coming from a relatively simple 2-stroke I spent many hours trying to educate myself. Read through all 199 pages of engine install manual, 175 pages of maintenance manual and 85 pages of operator's manual. Even read the heavy maintenance manual. It helped but I still think I would benefit from one of the Homebuilder's Help 912 Maintenance DVD's. It's a lot to absorb and comprehend for a dummy like me, and there is a lot to look for on a properly thorough pre-flight. The good news is the engine's track record proves a well maintained 912 is pretty much buckle up and fly through a pretty long TBO.

Personally, I am considering removing the carb heat box on my 912ul. I can not recall a single horror story with icing in a KF model 4 with bump cowl. Apparently, the position of carb intakes and the way the warm air circulates under cowl before exiting all but eliminate the possibility of severe icing. Not sure if the same might be true with your Avid Vagabond cowl however, but I tend to lean towards the K.I.S.S. philosophy when possible. I am sure you'll be very pleased with the plane when you get the kinks out, should be a real performer with that 100hp. Keep us posted!

Here is a copy of our last email (avid owner) after inquiring about the damage history and the repairs that followed.

"I put a new tail wheel on the airplane and it worked great on my turf runway, but on hard pavement it would shimmy. I made an adjustment and took it to our local airport to see if it helped any. When I landed it still had the shimmy and it pulled me to the right of the runway. Any other airport and I would have gone into the grass and it would have been a nonevent. But our local airport had a drainage ditch about 15ft. deep next to it and the plane went down into it. The left Flaperon attach points broke, the gear got torn off and the fuselage was bent. The engine was off but one blade got pushed back and broke as well.

I took the engine and prop off and sent the prop and hub back to the manufacture for inspection. They replaced one blade and had them send me a new prop hub as also as a safety precaution. I them tore the airplane all the way down and took it to Airdale who then put into their jig and cut out all the damage and welded in all new structure. I also purchased their bush gear and had them do the 16†fuselage stretch and raise the vertical, enlarge the rudder and install the dorsal fin. When I got it back I installed the Airdale Flaperon attach ribs (stronger then the Avid ribs), one new wing tip, all new fabric (except the horizontal and elevator), painted it and re-assembled the airplane. I took it on a test flight a few days before my bi-annual expired and flew 1.4 hrs to check the airplane out and did 4 takeoff and landings as well. As I told you, on the way back to my airstrip the engine stuttered so when I got back I inspected the engine and found a bad connection on the coil. I purchased a new coil and replaced it and ran the engine and couldn’t duplicate the problem. I then signed off the discrepancy in the logbook. If you decide to buy the airplane, I would recommend staying in the pattern just to make sure. I can be overly cautious, but I believe it’s just wise. That’s it. Thanks for the questions and don’t feel bad if you have some more. Rather you ask them now. Have great week!"

and some more, sorry if i double posted a few

Here's some better pictures I was sent, it's such a beautiful avid i have a hard time turning it down

Sounds like you are making good headway, unfortunately though, maybe a bit more work than anticipated. Now about those coolant lines. I presume you have the same 17mm i.d. as on the 80hp., have you found a suitable replacement to the 'cough-up-your-firstborn' price tag of the gen-u-ine Rotax branded Gates hose? My eye is still twitching after seeing the price on those.

No, I haven't checked hose prices. That's right around the corner though! The builder used 3/4 domestic hose in a lot of places. I think I need the metric. It is smaller OD which will allow me more room to safety wrap it in the many places where it rubs on the motor mount tubing. It's a crazy maze of hoses with all the coolant hoses, the carb heat hoses, and the oil hoses with the external oil temp regulator.... that's for sure. I'm seriously considering dumping the carb heat hoses even if I can't figure out how to remove the carb heat modules from the carbs. They apperar to be glued on somehow. My biggest challenge with this install will be to still have it easily inspectable once all the $h1t is installed on the engine! Neither the 582 or the 0-320 were anything like this in regard to how much crap covers the engine and mounts making it difficult to inspect!

ChrisB

Thanks for advice, err, observations. I know the Avid Mark IV with the EA81 has the airdale mods because the current owner landed in Missouri April of 2011 and got a wicked tailwheel shimmy after installing a new tailwheel, it pulled him to the left with full right rudder and he ran into a 15ft deep drainage ditch just off the runway.

Airdale took the aircraft and stripped it bare, they then completely rebuilt the fuesalage including the 16" stretch, enlarged rudder and elevator and upgraded the struts, ect. They also did the Airdale bush gear with the 21" Tundra's. The prop was sent in to Warp Drive and was completely inspected and rebuilt, a blade was replaced along with the spinner and it was rebalanced and returned to the owner. The engine was rebuilt also and has since has 68 hours on it but 2 hours ago had a ingition coil go bad during flight. The coil has been replaced and the engine has been run and they could not duplicate the problem, unfortunately it has not been flown since.

I trust the repairs but I was sent a picture of the empty weight of the aircraft as listed on the Builders Plaque and found the empty weight to be at 665lbs, that seems awfully high. The avid also has a max gross of 1,150 as listed on the certificate.

The aircraft overall only has 1.4 Hours since the latest repairs/upgrades, no flight time since the ignition discrepancy which has been written off and returned to service according to the owner.

That makes me very leary of the avid.

WHAT, pray tell - is a sand rail? Is that what we call dune buggies, made from VWs and other critters?

I had a mud rail once - rear engine 389 pontiac - real blast - and real wet!

ED in MO

Yes, its a dune buggy! A lot of fun!!

Hi Ed, thanks for the info. If you don't mind, I would like to talk rather than type, If you PM me your # I could give you a call. Mine is 218-254-2404 Thanks, Jim

Jim, I have a set of KF1 doors - actually may have more than one set - probably need lexan. Have some other spare parts too.

Let me know what you need.

If you want to PM me, I would like to know what the kit cost you. I've got a partial kit for sale.

ED in MO

Hi Doug, If it would be possible to give me the dimentions of the tube, I might have somthing here I can use. Looks like aluminum in the picture?? Also, if you don't mind, a closeup picture of each end. Thanks, Jim

Jim - I have the elevator P/P tube from my KF-3 lying around somewhere still. At worse, might need to cut it down a tad. And figure out how to ship the darn thing...

Looking for a prop for my avid mk4. 582 c box 3-1

7759109289

Thanks

Roy

Believe C5E "Joey" had one for sale.

ED in MO

Jim, I have a set of KF1 doors - actually may have more than one set - probably need lexan. Have some other spare parts too.

Let me know what you need.

If you want to PM me, I would like to know what the kit cost you. I've got a partial kit for sale.

ED in MO

I dont think you will need more useful load than the Avid will haul. Most dont haul a lot.

If my 4 tanks are full, then I will have to fly solo.

I would go with the Soob, but I am not skilled or knowledgeable about flying 2-strokes.

Some swear by them, others swear at them. Everything is a compromise.

ED in MO

Not so much advice as observations, but an Avid Mk-IV will be either 1150lb. or 1200lb. MTOW, and a Kitfox model 4 will be either 1050lb. or 1200lb. MTOW. A 582 powered Avid Mk-IV will likely have a lower empty weight than either of the Kitfoxes w/ a 582, ergo a higher useful load. IMHO, that KF w/panel plus Grove gear, lights etc. might be a bit on the heavy side for a 582. Looks like only a single wing tank too, so not a lot of range with full fuel and a couple porker pilots (like me, not necessarily you!). Be very careful to check for all telltale Avid oem Mk-IV improvements on that plane, they are separate from the Airdale mods. Many owners simply added 7/8" lift struts to a C model and called it 1200lb. MTOW Heavy Hauler. You might be able to see larger dia. tubing, but impossible to tell if seat truss or spar carry thru tubing wall thickness is increased on sealed tubes without cutting! Search for the list of Mk-IV mods I posted onsite and check for them at your pre-buy inspection.

Jim - I have the elevator P/P tube from my KF-3 lying around somewhere still. At worse, might need to cut it down a tad. And figure out how to ship the darn thing...

Ed- the feds fail to account for the layers of body fat necessary to weather the upstate NY winters. Translation: I eat out too often.

Jim, I'll buy breakfast if you keep it under 600lbs. I've only heard of a few and no one offered any proof. I was shocked to see 600lbs. on the initial W&B sent to the FAA for mine. I have to question it as the subsequent changes should not have added over 60lbs+, IMHO.

I live in Casper, WY and would be happy to look at it with you if I am free to do so. Let me know when you plan on being there and I will see what I can do.

Paul

Definitely may take you up on that. I'm not sure what town it is in, but I was planning on heading that way on the 26th or so. It's about a 3 day drive, maybe 4.

The dorsal fin shouldn't be an issue, I have pictures of it loaded on the trailer with the wings folded.

I'm going to look at a kitfox iv - 1200 with a rotax 582 next Monday. The panel is beautiful, best I have seen, but I hate 2 strokes in general. Not sure I feel comfortable flying with one. I can really appreciate the higher gross weight of the kitfox, the avid is definitely lacking in that department.

Link to the kitfox

http://www.barnstormers.com/listing.php?id=705287

Any recommendations for a first time buyer is greatly appreciated. Right now I wish I could just buy both, haha

Sounds like you are making good headway, unfortunately though, maybe a bit more work than anticipated. Now about those coolant lines. I presume you have the same 17mm i.d. as on the 80hp., have you found a suitable replacement to the 'cough-up-your-firstborn' price tag of the gen-u-ine Rotax branded Gates hose? My eye is still twitching after seeing the price on those.

Larry - do you have a TinyTach?

I have access to one and have been meaning to get it to verify my analog tach.

I was worried about my EGT's with the prop flattened out but I guess the extra RPM pumps enough gas through the mains to keep them in check. They were running pretty close to where they were before on takeoff. I tried a few different climbouts and found I was getting the best climb rate at 64-6500. I did put a couple washers in before I started and I hit the climb side perfect. If I hold the switch until the motor stalls out I get right at 6800 on takeoff. It's amazing how fast the engine winds up at that setting!! As soon as she breaks ground bump the switch once or twice to bring it back down to 6500 and away you go! At 50mph I was seeing over 1000fpm sustained and touched 1500 a couple times. I've never been able to sustain over a 1000 before. I was super light and it was cool here at Sea Level but that's still pretty awesome I was grinning from ear to ear. The 582 just even sounds sweet at 6700 vs 62 or 63.

Chris I had my warp pitched as a climb prop. One degree on the warp was close about 5-8mph on the top end. I was only getting 75-80 IAS before. Yesterday I left it wide open and pitched it for about 6200 and I things starting getting loud and when I looked up my airspeed was buried at 100mph. I think I should be able to cruise close to 85-90 at a reasonable power setting and pitch. I still need to figure out where I want it for cruise so that I'm not overloading the motor and then pull the prop and measure where the spool is and set the course limit. I was able to pull the motor down to 5800 for a second when I held the switch at full throttle which is WAY more pitch than I need.

The Hacman compliments the IFA nicely. I can't wait to take it up to altitude and do a couple of cruise phases and really get a feel for it. With it flattened out coming down final is cool too. The airplane responds instantly to power corrections. I'm also totally impressed at how much smoother it runs. Getting rid of that vibration was worth the swap in itself.

Well, call me curious or just plain nosey, but was wondering how other 4-1200's with 912ul FWF weigh out.

Builder of my 4-1200 did two prior W&B. First one when newly built on bungee gear w/ solid Maule TW (600lbs. empty), second done with Grove main gear, upgraded 2-leaf tailspring from Kitfox and a few other geegaw add-ons (668lbs.). I added 21-8.00x6 tires and a 3-leaf tailspring, but removed the solid Maule TW in favor of a smaller, lighter Aviation Products Inc. TW, so I really wanted (needed) to do a new weigh-in and W&B calculations.

Finally was able to check it off the to-do list this past weekend. Since I only have a half-hanger (gotta love those folding wings), we had to do this out on the ramp in a bit of wind so it probably isn't exactly perfect. Close enough for govmint work though, as the saying goes. So here are my results:

Left Main = 294lbs.

Right Main = 295lbs.

Tail Wheel = 78lbs.

Empty weight = 667lbs.

CG = 13.07"

A quick calc looks like (2) 200lb guys w/ 20gals fuel and lunch in the sack would be well within the envelope and under MTOW. In fact, if we did this right, it would appear you cannot possibly load the aircraft outside the Fwd or Aft CG in any way without exceeding the 1200lb. Gross Weight Limitation. Actually putting heavy pilots in the Aircraft moves the CG forward. Weight above the 40lb. limitation in the baggage sack is the only way to get even close to an Aft CG situation. Great design for an aircraft!

Thought FAA "certified" pilots and passengers could only weigh 170 lbs each for W&B? You could haul 10 more gallons of fuel at those weights!

ED in MO

Really Chris? Your "FLAT Avid"... I guess we have two in the Club, lol! Best chuckle I've had all day, thanks.

Larry - do you have a TinyTach?

Weren't we just talking about wing folding issues with a plane that had a dorsal fin added on it? Wonder if that is an issue at all here? If I remember right, the flaperon counterweights ran into the added fin area. Just something to think about. Did you by any chance see that Kitfox 4 in Kansas about a month ago? It had a 912, low time, guy was asking $22,000 for it. He had bought it to learn how to fly, and it was to much for him. He bought an Ercoupe, and had one plane to many. That one had the wheels turning in my mind. I had talked to the guy's flight instructor, and he told me about the plane. He was really impressed with it. It probably sold quick, but if it didn't, it would be worth looking into. Closer too! Another topic: Ed, you said you saw an early Avid being built in Alaska. Did that plane by any chance belong to a guy named Jim Haney? Poor guy, brought it back to Mn, about half done, but got cancer and passed away before he could finish it. A flying buddy of mine ended up buying it, and finished it. I never met Jim Haney, he must have been quite a guy, he was on at least one of the expeditions that dug out the Glacier Gal P 38 in Greenland, and he also had something to do with the Global Explorer Dean Wilson designed. Take care, Jim Chuk

So the guy with the KF4 is now learning to fly all over again in an Ercoupe - Good Luck to him.

The guy who built the Airdale #1 was not Jim Haney. This guy finished his.

ED in MO

I live in Casper, WY and would be happy to look at it with you if I am free to do so. Let me know when you plan on being there and I will see what I can do.

Paul

There you are - Lucky you - Got an owner willing to help in wyoming.

Good Luck,

ED in MO

Hi all, A while back, I ran accross a Kitfox 1 kit that had very little done on it. I ended up bringing it home today, I don't intend to build it at this time, more likly going to roll it over and hopefully come out just a bit ahead on the deal. Not sure what will be best, part it out or keep it togeather. So far, it seems I'm missing the doors, and the elevator push-pull tube. The guy is going to look for them, so maybe they will still turn up. Anyway, that's the story for today. Here are a few pics. Got quite a few boxes of small parts, didn't put them on the floor with the big stuff for the pics, but it seems like most if not all of that stuff is there. Take care, Jim Chuk

PS last 2 pics of the wheel hubs and brakes. Never saw brakes like this before, anyone familar with them?