Proper ID in Traffic Pattern?

[LSaupe 123]

I am a bit confused over what is the proper way to identify yourself in a traffic pattern of a class G airport at surface (no tower or ATC involved). Locally getting some conflicting information.

I have just been using my make and N number "Kitfox 123AB".  Others claim you need to add color... "Red Kitfox 123AB", some say just make and color "Red Kitfox". Others indicate you must add "Experimental" and now I am hearing also "Light Sport" as well (some say these go before and some say after the Make and N number).  Others say add also the model and if it is high wing or low wing

What is correct (looking more for actual requirements vice personal preferences)?  My previous understanding was that "Experimental" was added only for an initial call to ATC (then dropped), and this is added after the N number.

If you string all this mess together you get "Sky Ranch Traffic - Red high wing Kitfox Model III 123AB Experimental Light Sport..."   Obviously that makes no sense (or maybe does it)?

 

 

 

 

 

[Av8r3400 1179]

When in a class G airport, logically what good is continuously announcing your n number?  It isn't required by any regulation.  Can anyone actually see the number?  Other traffic can see a yellow (or blue or white or whatever) airplane.

This would be how I was told to announce:

"Anytown area traffic, Yellow Kitfox 123 Alpha is five miles north, inbound for landing runway zero two."

Afterthat I would identify only as "Yellow Kitfox".   That's all that's needed.  "Anytown traffic, Yellow Kitfox, left downwind, zero two", "Yellow Kitfox, short final zero two, full stop", etc. 

In my operating limitations it does state that I shall identify as an "Experimental" aircraft when contacting ATC. 

An example of this would be:

"Big City Approach, Experimental Kitfox 123 Alpha, with (ATIS data), is with you over (whatever reporting point)"

After that they will refer to you, and you to yourself, as only your N Number.

 

Edited 26 Jan 2016 by Av8r3400

[Geoffrey Thorpe 31]

The FCC regulations require you to use your station identification - which would be your N number.

The Airman's Information Manual covers the "standard phraseology" which would be "Kitfox N12345", but many pilot have their own opinions and reasons for doing it some non-standard way.

[gregpro50 64]

I hear everyone do it a little different.  I think it really depends on how you were taught.

One of my instructor's pet peeves is when someone says "checking in" or "with you" when contacting ATC.

He also has me announce my full N-number and model at non-controlled airports at every leg of the pattern.  He even has me make sure the gear is down and locked every time we go through the pre-landing checklist even though we've never flown a retractable plane.

[MarkD 53]

In class "G" airspace or most other Non-Controlled airspace announcing your intentions or position in the traffic pattern is "Good Airmanship" type behavior.  Similar to being a nice guy. It is actually not required at all. (As stated above by Av8r3400.)  If the traffic is relatively busy I will generally give my ID as my "N" number (minus the N of course, it is implied for US registered aircraft).  I will do this for the first couple of announcements then abbreviate the call to just the last number and letters,

example: "Jefferson County traffic 577MikeDelta departing runway 09", " Jeffco traffic 577MikeDelta right crosswind", "Jeffco traffic 7MikeDelta right downwind 09"....etc.  I usually state the airport I'm near because there are several airports in our area all on the same frequency.

I simply want other traffic to know what my intentions are without cluttering up the radio with useless information.  Of course there are several folks working out of my local field that use no radio at all, perfectly OK, we all just have to look out for each other, give the other guy plenty of room to do the unexpected and not be surprised by it.

In controlled airspace at towered airports there are rules, dang-it, so I try to follow the rules and not draw undue attention to my small EXPERIMENTAL aircraft.  In congested airspace proper radio techniques become more important, but remember, the ATC guys are there to help you if you need help.  Just ask and if you get crap from them you can always remind them by asking "Who is going to suffer the most (or die) if you make a mistake?".  I did that once to a snotty ATC guy and all of a sudden he got real professional and very helpful and we all went home happy.  There is nothing wrong with being inexperienced or under trained and asking for help.  They (the ATC guys) will help you if you ask mainly because they would hate to have an "Event" on their watch and the volume of paperwork associated with an "Event" is significant.  Other pilots will often help if they perceive another pilot may be having difficulty especially with communications.

A lot of instructors will make student pilots announce at every leg in the pattern so they become familiar with radio techniques and so they learn how to multitask in the cockpit environment. Funny as it seems, the radio intimidates many low time pilots.  Checklists, radio work, looking for traffic, route planning, approach / departure planning are all part of the pilot workload and after time will become second nature.  So the more you do it the more comfortable you are with it.

Just my 2 pennies worth,

MarkD

[lostman 198]

As a CFI I agree that you should keep communications short and concise. I understand that having a student pilot make a call at every turn in the pattern is used simply to get over the mic fright. Personally I adhere to what the A.I.M. states. I don't use a color of aircraft it's not normal nomenclature although can be useful in high traffic areas. Use your abbreviated tailnumber when you can. No one is going to remember the whole thing (unless they are ATC and you need to use it anyway). I use experimental because no one knows what a Teenie Two looks like but not on every call. Search the A.I.M. for guidance, and please don't let anyone teach you to use the words, "any other traffic please advise". That's just really bad terminology. Most don't understand what the FAA has stated about it, look it up, it's an interesting read. I won't go into my thoughts on it though. 

Just remember whatever you do, make sure you keep your eyes outside the cockpit, that is much more important than a radio call. Above all else: Aviate, Navigate, then communicate. If you're too busy making a radio call instead of doing a critical checklist it won't matter in the end when you do forget your gear (or other major item). tying up a frequency isn't needed either. Simple heads up and quick calls can really make a difference for everyone. Especially if you live in an area when on a beautiful Saturday morning there are 10 airports on the same frequency and all busy as can be. 

[Fly-n-Low 181]

Never used a color. If I was in a familiar aircraft, I would say the name of it, Cessna,  etc then the N number. If not a familiar aircraft, I was instructed to say "November".

[dav8or 20]

As a CFI I agree that you should keep communications short and concise. I understand that having a student pilot make a call at every turn in the pattern is used simply to get over the mic fright. Personally I adhere to what the A.I.M. states. I don't use a color of aircraft it's not normal nomenclature although can be useful in high traffic areas. Use your abbreviated tailnumber when you can. No one is going to remember the whole thing (unless they are ATC and you need to use it anyway). I use experimental because no one knows what a Teenie Two looks like but not on every call.

I fly out of one airport that is just outside both a class B to surface ring under a 2000ft shelf with a class D butting up to it. There is also a very active private strip within 3 miles. That combined with a high level of student traffic plus a mix of low speed and jet traffic is the reason I will call every leg of the pattern at that airport so I would say it depends on the particular airport. I agree with the abbreviated tail number. I happen to fly my Grumman from that airport and my Avid from a private grass strip where we use minimal calls because we usually know who is up and where they are. I have been asked before if I was the blue grumman by others in the pattern so they can confirm position but I do not announce it in a normal call. I use Experimental + number for controlled airspace. I don't remember ever hearing anyone announcing as the model for an experimental type in this area. The controller will ask if they want to know. Usually they want to know the speed you are capable of instead.

Dan