Aileron / flap leading edge

[Tree top pilot 13]

I know that the Highlander used fiberglass....and I was given sawn blocks of 2" home foam insulation board to form the leading edges. I made these from 1/64" ply from Aircraft Spruce with about 30 some pieces of balsa nose ribs to help maintain shape spaced 5" apart. I have invested a lot of time in my mold and process for this....not cheaper or quick to perform.....but man is it light and strong. No steam boxes....just hot water soak and then to my mold overnight. Taped to allow full drying .....praying it won't distort too much. When they are installed and sealed up they shouldn't move anywhere....your thoughts ? Or have I wasted time doing this? If I have to make a mold for fiberglass....I would rather lay them up with Carbon and vacuum bag 'em. Same amount of work either way.

[EDMO 1078]

Noticed that you have had no feedack on this - I'm always interested in any building ideas.

Don't know what plane you are building, but wonder if making aluminum skin over whole aileron / flap might be easier / better?

ED in MO

[Tree top pilot 13]

Everything I do is a PITA. That is what keeps me interested..all the hard things to be made. My plane is a Ridge Runner. Just trying to keep it as light as possible plus I like working with wood. I just want to cover the leading edges so the fabric will lay out a bit smoother and help to hold the shape. The slotted flaps should work well at low speeds. Almost ready to start covering the wings....not much left to do to the fuse. Engine is ready...all I need to get on the way is a prop. Thanks for looking....pix posted when ready to cover.

Edited 17 May 2012 by Tree top pilot

[EDMO 1078]

Have heard of the Ridgerunner - is it copy of Kitfox / Avid? How are the ailerons / flaps attached?

Any place where I can get pictures, info? Where is it made?

Just nosey!

I may have it confused with the Ranger (I think?) I pulled one up and it was all aluminum and 1000 bolts holding it together - too many nuts to come loose to suit my caution.

ED in MO

[Tree top pilot 13]

It is this plane here...factory demo..This one was at Oshkosh a few years ago.... say..... around 2001. This plane had the speed wing option....note the rib profile. Built my wings with the undercambered airfoil.....similar to the Skyraider/Avid/Kitfox type of wing construction. Ailerons and flaps are hung from dual hinges attached to the rib's TE .

[EDMO 1078]

Nice plane - Would like to see those rib hinges. How do you control ailerons & flaps? Wanted to make mine flush with wings, but at present am still with the KF / Avid design. Any builder's books available? Balanced tailfeathers look good - did that to mine.

Do wings fold?

What is gross weight?

ED in MO

Edited 17 May 2012 by Ed In Missouri

[Tree top pilot 13]

This is how the flaps and aileron attach to the hinges. The aileron has a 1" tube spar/torque tube with ribs as you can see. Offset hinge points with control inputs via closed loop cable. Set up is exactly like the cub except along the rear spar and rear lift strut. Most aspects of the wing are very close to the Highlander design....but I made my wingtips from tubing rather than fiberglass. The flaps are slotted so the hinge point is a bit lower than the aileron. I fabbed these from 1/16" T-6. Hinge points have bronze bushings. I picked up a small toaster oven at the Goodwill and done some powder coating at home....saves time from painting these small parts after beadblasting.

Edited 18 May 2012 by Tree top pilot

[EDMO 1078]

Thanks for the photos - Looks like a nice clean solid setup - I guess I could figure out how to do it on mine, but I have spent so much time modifying and building that I will stay with the Avid setup and folding wings.

Is your wing trailing edge wood or metal? Guess you are going with light-fabric? Have you checked out the Stewart system?

BTW: Make sure you keep a cose eye on those cables - I got a little worried when a Cessna flap cable broke with me on final, just over the threshold - went into a 90 degree bank a wingtip over the runway (or seemed like it)!

I don't worry so much about push-pull tubes.

Cubs didnt have that problem: NO Flaps!

ED in MO

[Tree top pilot 13]

Is your wing trailing edge wood or metal? Guess you are going with light-fabric? Have you checked out the Stewart system?

Yes folding wings are standard all models. The TE is aluminum.....same that Aircraft Spruce sells. Plan on using light cloth with polyfiber system....I am allergic to isocyanates...hardeners. It is made from cyanide you know and if you use it you better cover yourself up totally and have a fresh air system. That stuff will penetrate you eyes...any exposed skin. Really sour on them for not telling customers the whole truth about the hazzards of the product line. Sorry for the rant....

[EDMO 1078]

Thanks - OK to rant, IMO, if you think that there is a need to. I still plan to use that system, along with all the protective gear - I'm no chemist, but I sure don't like the old systems.

I worked in fiberglas for nearly 30 years - we were all concerned about the effects of grinding the glass fibers, but the company always downplayed our concerns. WHAT THEY DID NOT DISCLOSE, was the risk of the vapors from the epoxy and hardner!!!

Several of us got cancer - but no proof of what caused it.

ED in MO

[akflyer 1427]

ok, just to chime in on this one... they sell the product (stewarts) like it was water and you could drink it.... do yourself a favor and download the MSDS on it. I dont know how the BAD WORD they can advertise it like they do as being 100% safe yada yada I think the marketing guy must do a ton of this!

[EDMO 1078]

ok, just to chime in on this one... they sell the product (stewarts) like it was water and you could drink it.... do yourself a favor and download the MSDS on it. I dont know how the BAD WORD they can advertise it like they do as being 100% safe yada yada I think the marketing guy must do a ton of this!

I believe that their ad just says that the THINNER is water. If you watch the videos, they show and tell you about using the proper protection.

IMO, there is no safe system. I just hate the old systems so much, and like this one so much better, so will use it again.

One other good thing: NO explosion or fire hazard with Stewarts.

One last parting shot: There will NEVER again, be any MEK or Acetone, or welding in my shop!

ED in MO: 3 x Cancer survivor (I hope!)

Edited 20 May 2012 by Ed In Missouri

[akflyer 1427]

I believe that their ad just says that the THINNER is water. If you watch the videos, they show and tell you about using the proper protection.

IMO, there is no safe system. I just hate the old systems so much, and like this one so much better, so will use it again.

One other good thing: NO explosion or fire hazard with Stewarts.

One last parting shot: There will NEVER again, be any MEK or Acetone, or welding in my shop!

ED in MO: 3 x Cancer survivor (I hope!)

3X WOW, Glad your still around to play!

[Av8r3400 1179]

Stewart's is advertized as "Water Born" not "water based".

They claim you can drink their thinner (distilled water) but don't mention a thing about the base products born by the water. This is where all the nastiness lives.

I have swung away from Stewart's after being pretty well sold on it. I'll be doing Poly Fiber. MEK is much less toxic than the isocyonates. I've dealt with these products before (automotive painting with DuPont Imron). I was horribly sick after spraying that product - even with a full pressurized, fresh air suit. I'm not going through that again.

[EDMO 1078]

3X WOW, Glad your still around to play!

Me too! 20 years ago, Doctors told me to sell my welder, and stay away from all those bad chemicals I had been using for years, after losing a kidney.

My welding bill on this plane is nearing $3000, but my hospital bills were near $150,000! I chose not to weld or even be in the same room as welding.

My "Hero" was a 95 year-old who flew the original 1929 Stearman he bought new. Had his 80 year-old girlfriend hold the brakes while he propped it.

He passed away last year at age 100.

29 more to go for my century mark! So please excuse me if I seem adament about chemicals.

Hoping to get someone else to spray my plane. I did spray part of a J3 and the Stewart didn't bother me. (Lucky?)

Good Flying,

ED in MO

Edited 20 May 2012 by Ed In Missouri

[akflyer 1427]

I think you guys may have missed my point.. Do a quick search on the web and other forums and you will see that the GENERAL missconception about stewarts is that you can shoot it in your living room without a respirator or anything else and your kids, cats, dogs and wife wont mind cause it dont smell and you can drink the stuff..

This is stemming from the marketing of the product and by the claims that you can "drink the thinner" Without doing more research, one is led to believe that this system is 100% safe and non toxic. That is simply NOT TRUE, it may not stink, but it does have toxins, and the MSDS's on the materials is kind of an eye opener and makes you raise your eyebrows, scratch your nutts and think to yourself, now just how in the hell can they advertise this the way they do Maybe its just me

To each his own, and people reactions to chemicals is all different. The stits products may put one guy in the hospital, but the next can shoot it without ventilation and get nothin more than a good buzz.. The same with the Stewarts, etc.

[EDMO 1078]

I think you guys may have missed my point.. Do a quick search on the web and other forums and you will see that the GENERAL missconception about stewarts is that you can shoot it in your living room without a respirator or anything else and your kids, cats, dogs and wife wont mind cause it dont smell and you can drink the stuff..

This is stemming from the marketing of the product and by the claims that you can "drink the thinner" Without doing more research, one is led to believe that this system is 100% safe and non toxic. That is simply NOT TRUE, it may not stink, but it does have toxins, and the MSDS's on the materials is kind of an eye opener and makes you raise your eyebrows, scratch your nutts and think to yourself, now just how in the hell can they advertise this the way they do Maybe its just me

To each his own, and people reactions to chemicals is all different. The stits products may put one guy in the hospital, but the next can shoot it without ventilation and get nothin more than a good buzz.. The same with the Stewarts, etc.

Never said that either of you are wrong about Stewarts. Think it is good to get all this info out to everyone, and they can decide which poison to use. I think a good process would be to use Stewarts glue, and then whatever finish you want. I love the dry glue!

This will be my last build - Hope I can fly this one all the way to wherever old pilots go!

ED in MO

Edited 20 May 2012 by Ed In Missouri

[akflyer 1427]

This will be my last build - Hope I can fly this one all the way to wherever old pilots go!

ED in MO

I will drink to that! But I hope to one day meet again some of the young pilots that have gone there way to soon also.

[EDMO 1078]

I will drink to that! But I hope to one day meet again some of the young pilots that have gone there way to soon also.

And, I will second that motion!

Back to Stewart - I know everyone must be tired of this by now:

As I said, I Love their glue process - No more wet glue all over me - the Ekofill UV protection is not bad either.

Someone told me that after the Ekofill brush and spray, He used Randolph finish coats. Guess time will tell if his idea works.

Would take someone smarter than me to figure out things like that.

I'm finished beating this horse to death - been interesting tho!

Good Flying,

ED in MO

Edited 21 May 2012 by Ed In Missouri