Cable swagging tool

[High Country 69]

I wasn't sure where to put this so if someone wants to move it to a better location feel free to do so, thanks

I was recently in need of a cable swagging tool to make my rudder cables but found that they are pretty expensive for just a couple of simple crimps. In my search however i found that home depot has a pretty good quality one for only $19.97 sku#566745 http://www.homedepot.com/Tools-Hardware-Hand-Tools-Specialty-Tools/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xk4Zapul/R-100243794/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&storeId=10051 and to make it better home depot will accept all competitors coupons and harbor freight has 20% off coupons in every Sunday paper so total price $15.98 sure beats $100.00 bucks for a couple quick crimps. anyways hope it helps someone.

-Robert-

[TheDeltaFox 0]

Off to Home Depot I go

Thx

[Av8r3400 1179]

I would suggest getting a go/no-go gauge to check your swages with, especially using a non aircraft designed squeezer.

My AI would not pass that example visually. I was told you should be able to see the three individual squeezes. It looks like the swage is either too wide or nicopress sleeves are too short.

Considering the life and death nature of rudder cables on these planes, I don't think this would be an area where going cheap is the best policy.

Just my opinion.

[EDMO 1078]

I would suggest getting a go/no-go gauge to check your swages with, especially using a non aircraft designed squeezer.

My AI would not pass that example visually. I was told you should be able to see the three individual squeezes. It looks like the swage is either too wide or nicopress sleeves are too short.

Considering the life and death nature of rudder cables on these planes, I don't think this would be an area where going cheap is the best policy.

Just my opinion.

I second that opinion! get gage.

I was also "saved" from mistake of buying cheap, chinese, cable once - I had to "save" my flying partner to pay for that one!

Spruce also sells a cheap, (tighten bolts on swage blocks) that does an acceptable job. Still, you need gage.

Ed in MO

[High Country 69]

I used the cheap go-no-go gauge that aircraft spruce sales and all my crimps checked out good. Also i had an A&P check it out and he said I was good to go. These crimpers are pretty heavy and feel very solid to me.

-Robert-

Edited 22 Apr 2012 by High Country

[EDMO 1078]

I used the cheap go-no-go gauge that aircraft spruce sales and all my crimps checked out good. Also i had an A&P check it out and he said I was good to go. These crimpers are pretty heavy and feel very solid to me.

-Robert-

Great! Now you can consider yourself, "saved"! (at least, saved from our comments!)

Ed in MO

[akflyerbob 41]

I have both, the stupidly expensive aircraft swagging tool

and the home depo tool.

They make the same swage. It all depends how you hold the tool and start the swage.

In the first pictures you can see the tool was not held straight, making

a visualy ugly swage.

[akflyer 1427]

For what its worth, I would not think twice about flying those rudder cables. There is NO WAY IN HECK that you could ever put enough force on them from flying to pull them apart. If you did, it would only be because you wadded that plane up into a ball so small that it would no longer matter to you if the swage was visually perfect or not I used the home depot press to make up flying wires for the float rigging and believe me, they have been stress tested with no slippage at all. As was pointed out, use a go-no-go gauge on ANY swage as the jaws on even the stupid expensive one can get worn over time.

[EDMO 1078]

For what its worth, I would not think twice about flying those rudder cables. There is NO WAY IN HECK that you could ever put enough force on them from flying to pull them apart. If you did, it would only be because you wadded that plane up into a ball so small that it would no longer matter to you if the swage was visually perfect or not I used the home depot press to make up flying wires for the float rigging and believe me, they have been stress tested with no slippage at all. As was pointed out, use a go-no-go gauge on ANY swage as the jaws on even the stupid expensive one can get worn over time.

I respectfully disagree with some of your thoughts, but certainly agree with you too. We used to test cable fittings with a strain-gage, and I have seen some failures at figures far below the strengths of the cables, with forces you could put on with your legs. You would be surprized at how much force you can put on with your legs, compounded by the leverage in controls. I can only pull with my weight, but I can push about three times that much force. Look at the guys who lift 1000 pounds or more. Some rules are put there for a good reason, and we all need to do everything we can to be safe. Listening to others is sometimes a good practice. No-go gages are a cheap and easy insurance that we have done something right, no matter which tool we used.

Ed in MO

[akflyer 1427]

yes and no.. In order to put force on it, you would have to have resistance. That lil rudder at the speeds we fly DOES NOT put enough resistance on the cables. I have never, EVER had to do a 600# leg press to move the rudder on the Avid, or any other light aircraft for that matter. Can you improperly swage it so you have less than the strength of the cable rating? Sure, too much or too little and you wont get a full pull on it. in reality, a 1/16th cable would have more than enough strength required to run that rudder all day long. There is alot more fudge factor built in. When designing this type of thing, you take into account the fact that guys are building this stuff in their garage and that the quality of workmanship has a good chance of being sub par to an extent.

Does anyone know of any plane ever brought down due to a failed rudder cable??

[EDMO 1078]

yes and no.. In order to put force on it, you would have to have resistance. That lil rudder at the speeds we fly DOES NOT put enough resistance on the cables. I have never, EVER had to do a 600# leg press to move the rudder on the Avid, or any other light aircraft for that matter. Can you improperly swage it so you have less than the strength of the cable rating? Sure, too much or too little and you wont get a full pull on it. in reality, a 1/16th cable would have more than enough strength required to run that rudder all day long. There is alot more fudge factor built in. When designing this type of thing, you take into account the fact that guys are building this stuff in their garage and that the quality of workmanship has a good chance of being sub par to an extent.

Does anyone know of any plane ever brought down due to a failed rudder cable??

OK - Great analysis. Totally agree.

Ed in MO

[Av8r3400 1179]

I wld counter that opinion by saying that rudder action is not where the most force is generated. The max force is generated while braking. Enough force to break welds in rudder peddles. I would say that's enough to stress a poor crimp to failure. It would be a cumulative failure not an all at once thing. But the failure would happen without warning.

There is/was a YouTube video of a Kitfox crash from this.

Just something to think about.

Edited 23 Apr 2012 by Av8r3400

[EDMO 1078]

I wld counter that opinion by saying that rudder action is not where the most force is generated. The max force is generated while braking. Enough force to break welds in rudder peddles. I would say that's enough to stress a poor crimp to failure. It would be a cumulative failure not an all at once thing. But the failure would happen without warning.

There is/was a YouTube video of a Kitfox crash from this.

Just something to think about.

Again, I agree. With all the brains in action, something usefull has to come out of this.

At least it has everyone thinking.

ED in MO

[akflyer 1427]

I remember quite a few broken rudder pedals due to the piss poor geometry of the brake mounting and not being able to get enough pressure to the master cylinder.. I could be wrong (hell yeah, it has happened many times before) but I don't remember any rudder cables pulling out or breaking at the swage. Hell I damn near wadded mine up when the tail wheel chains were loose and the tail wheel unlocked and I didnt have enough brakes to keep it straight. Yep, that lil ride is on youtube, so is joeys lil quick 360 at mile high. I have also seen cables get worn and frayed where they have worn through the teflon guides and started cutting into the metal mounts that caused a cable failure, but not at the swage. As I stated, I could very well be wrong, but if I make a crimp, it is good on the go-no-go gauge, I am gonna use it. I would bet a pay check that the one shown will pull 100% if you put it on a strain gauge.

A quick example. Take a look at the piss poor welds on a 1942 piper. They will scare the ever loving shit out of you, yet somehow, they have managed to hold up to the abuse that we can dish out. I have seen welds in very critical areas that I would not pass on a visual by one of my welders even on a garbage dumpster, yet they are still holding up just fine.

The redesigned pedals make braking action 100 times better and MUCH less force is needed to keep things pointed in the right direction. I dont have to stand on the brakes anymore to get the darn thing to turn or stop (except when I am on skis, the brakes dont work for shit then no matter how hard I have stood on those pedals)

Great disscusion and lots of points of views. I guess it all comes down to the fact that some people are perfectionists (you see that alot more in the home built market than in factory certified planes) and others are willing to accept some imperfections. Lots of people would never consider flying a plane with a few rolls of duct tape on it, others, like myself, dont think twice about it