582 Fat Avid?

[larr 0]

I am trying to decide what to pursue. I have a MK1V with a good 582 that has a messed up fuselage. The money to get back in the air will be the same. Do I want to go with another standard fuselage, or should I get a fat fuselage. Currently, I would have to use the 582 with heavy hauler wings and tail feathers. Our mission use is pleasure flying out of approved grass strips. My son 16, is currently 5 10 ish, 150ish, I'm the same but about 170. My current airplane has a grove gear, battery all the way in the rear and 11# lead lead in the tail. I invission that the fat Avid with bush gear would weigh as much or even less than the current setup. I am thinking going the Fat way for future considerations as we grow, or a bigger engine in the future.

Pros/cons ideas......

thanks,

larry

Edited 6 Sep 2012 by larr

[BryceKat 125]

I am trying to decide what to pursue. I have a MK1V with a good 582 that has a messed up fuselage. The money to get back in the air will be the same. Do I want to go with another standard fuselage, or should I get a fat fuselage. Currently, I would have to use the 582 with heavy hauler wings and tail feathers. Our mission use is pleasure flying out of approved grass strips. My son 16, is currently 5 10 ish, 150ish, I'm the same but about 170. My current airplane has a grove gear, battery all the way in the rear and 11# lead lead in the tail. I invission that the fat Avid with bush gear would weigh as much or even less than the current setup. I am thinking going the Fat way for future considerations as we grow, or a bigger engine in the future.

Pros/cons ideas......

thanks,

larry

Larry,

If I had a good reason to buy a fat fuselage for the same $$$ and evrything else, wings etc., would work, I think I would go for it! What happened to your fuselage? Bryce

[dholly 718]

@larr-

I would go for the Fat Avid fuselage rather than rebuild the Mk-IV, no hesitation! The Avid+ airframe is 18" longer overall, 4" wider at the rear door post and 8" wider across the instrument panel door post than a Mk-IV fuselage. Those Avid+ improvements add weight, although it may not be as much as you think. The Avid Mk-IV frame weighs in at ~70lbs. and the Avid+ frame ~80lbs., so very little incremental weight increase for a longer, stronger, wider fuse with adjustable seats, larger balanced rudder, improved controls, open baggage area, etc.

Assuming the same 582 engine, and empty weights within 20lbs or so (Mk-IV w/ Grove gear vs. Avid+ w/ bush gear), I believe performance would be similar overall but still noticeably in favor of the Mk-IV. Depends on what your Mk-IV empty weight was but, even if you won't be winning any STOL contests with that engine/airframe combination, I'm sure you could bolt on your 582 and go satisfy your desire to fly as you save up for the engine of choice. And you would be doing so in a much more comfortable cockpit.

Just remember, when you swap your existing Avid wings with lift and jury struts, your Fat Avid M.T.O.W. is now limited to your original Avid Mk-IV which I assume is 1200lb gross. The 'official' factory gross of the full Avid+ kit I have with that exact same wing is 1250lb., due to improvements such as stronger fuselage, larger dia. rear carry thru tube and 2" longer spar stiffeners than the Mk-IV fuse. If you have the 1050lb gross you would probably want to upgrade the wings IMHO.

-Doug

[larr 0]

Thank Doug,

Will the MK1V elevator & horizontal stab work on the +? I understand that the plus has a balance rudder - is that manditory, or can one get away with using the 1V's rudder?

[dholly 718]

I have one of only eight complete Avid+ kits sold by [old] Airdale, but most of these frames were sold to existing Avid Flyer owners as the Fat Avid upgrade. Airdale provided the frame with new doors, instrument panel and dash. Owners swapped their existing Avid elevator, H.S. and braces, tailspring/wheel, main gear, rudder pedals & brakes, control system etc. onto the new fuse. There is some confusion on the seats rudder. I have saved a post by Steve Winder of [old] Airdale from July 2002 when the Fat Avid upgrade was first introduced that said you must reuse your old seat and rudder. However, my Avid+ kit came with new adjustable seats backs and a balanced rudder, and every Avid+ I've ever seen (full kit or Fat Avid upgrade) had the new seats and balanced rudder too. Perhaps [old] Airdale made a change before production began, dunno. If I had a Mk-IV rudder, I would check to see if the same jig was used to locate the hinge bushings on the rudder post for both rudders. Hey, you never know, and that would be awesome because you would only need do a much smaller modification to your old rudder rather than fabricate an entirely new one.