Jabiru 2200 giant thread

[Emory Bored 61]

Greetings Lads and Laddies:

Somewhere I saw a giant really informative thread on a Jabiru install by somebody who had some smarts. It was full of hints and kinks for working out the overheating issues. I'm now looking at a Jab powered airplane and want to reread the thread while paying attention.

I've used the search here and Team Kitfox and I can't find it.

Anybody know where I saw that??

EB

[4aplat 2]

Greetings Lads and Laddies:

Somewhere I saw a giant really informative thread on a Jabiru install by somebody who had some smarts. It was full of hints and kinks for working out the overheating issues. I'm now looking at a Jab powered airplane and want to reread the thread while paying attention.

I've used the search here and Team Kitfox and I can't find it.

Anybody know where I saw that??

EB

may be this one ?

http://jabiru-engine-inspection.blogspot.com/

I'm not sure Jabiru is the engine of the future

MicheL

[Av8r3400 1179]

I have two friends running the 4-cylinder jab motors. One on a 701 (mid 2000s) the other on a mk 4 Avid (unknown vintage). Neither have cooling issues. Both just purr smooth as can be behind wood props.

[4aplat 2]

I have two friends running the 4-cylinder jab motors. One on a 701 (mid 2000s) the other on a mk 4 Avid (unknown vintage). Neither have cooling issues. Both just purr smooth as can be behind wood props.

here is a "souvenir" of my first jab...........

no cooling problem on the plane.......

[Av8r3400 1179]

Ouch...

[Emory Bored 61]

Obviously I'm not communicating here. French? We're all aware of the noise in the background. Somebody with an Avid IV has worked through the issues on his second Jabiru motor. Someplace on the web is a lengthy thread of that analysis and work through.

Ahh Ha! I found it: http://www.zenith.aero/forum/topics/mr-smith-and-his-third-jabiru

EB

Edited 12 Mar 2012 by Emory Bored

[4aplat 2]

Obviously I'm not communicating here. French? We're all aware of the noise in the background. Somebody with an Avid IV has worked through the issues on his second Jabiru motor. Someplace on the web is a lengthy thread of that analysis and work through.

Ahh Ha! I found it: http://www.zenith.aero/forum/topics/mr-smith-and-his-third-jabiru

EB

the link is about the 6 cylinders jab

this engine has a lot of problems like gas flow in the middle cylinder and hover heating in the same one

but the main problem of the jab is the cylinder head : not enough aluminum, bad quality valve guides (with a hole !!!), no valve gasket and for some (bad numbers) a camshaft for solid lifters used with hydraulic lifters etc.......

[C5Engineer 1170]

The guy I bought my FWF from has a thousand hours behind his in an Avid B model but he did a ton of messing with it to get it where he was happy with it and if Im not mistaken blew one up in the process. On the flip side Herman on here just removed his Jab and put a 582 back on because he was disappointed with the loss of STOL performance.

[4aplat 2]

The guy I bought my FWF from has a thousand hours behind his in an Avid B model but he did a ton of messing with it to get it where he was happy with it and if Im not mistaken blew one up in the process. On the flip side Herman on here just removed his Jab and put a 582 back on because he was disappointed with the loss of STOL performance.

The jab is supposed to deliver 80 HP

I'm steel looking for the 15 last horses (and may be more)

The jab is a direct driver and the rotax is re-ducted so it could have more RPM and a larger propeller (turning slower)

the rotax is lighter than the jab

so at the end, using a jab in an avid is a non sense (and I don't talk about valve guide failure and other problems)

[Emory Bored 61]

The Jabiru has a ton of bad news around it. But it has it's supporters. Curiously enough. The 2 Stroke motors, including the 582 have a ton of bad news around them too. Curiously enough. I need to go for a ride in one, or the other, or both.

I think the Jab is out for me. If one F's up, I can spend so much money sorting it that I think I'd give up. My mind changes by the hour. There is a nice Super SkyRaider with Jabiru available. My wife hates tandem. I love it.

Darcy has a nice Avid MK IV in Alberta, Canada. Grey head. It's nice and quite well equipped. Priced pretty good. All the money is together. Decisions. Darcy's airplane is right on my budget. Room to spare. I need to borrow or rent a trailer though. I don't want to make my transition to Avid in a big hurry and then fly 1500 miles through the ice and snow

Would you just look at the size of that dude! Or thats a very tiny airplane.

Edited 13 Mar 2012 by Emory Bored

[C5Engineer 1170]

I have a custom trailer and all the hardware to secure everything that you are more than welcome to. It's licensed and legal with good tires and lights. I wouldn't hesitate to pull it across the country. I towed mine 850 miles one time.

[Emory Bored 61]

I have a custom trailer and all the hardware to secure everything that you are more than welcome to. It's licensed and legal with good tires and lights. I wouldn't hesitate to pull it across the country. I towed mine 850 miles one time.

I was sure hoping you'd chime in here C5engineer. (I don't know if we're staying anonymous here) I knew you had a trailer. I'm going to be out of town from Thursday morning until Monday. A decision is in the offing.

I'll keep you and Darcy posted.

Dan

[herman pahls 9]

Since Joey mentioned that I went back to a 582 from a Jabiru 2200, I will share some of what I have learned.

I installed the Jabiru 2200 80 HP ( I paid $2500) knowing full well that the newer 85 HP Jabiru was preferable because of the increased torque that would allow more prop pitch for lower fuel burn at cruise and still have 582 climb performance on a light weight Avid or Kitfox.

I could not allow myself to spend $15,000 for the 85 HP engine alone and still end up with a $15,000 Kitfox.

In order for the 80 HP Jabiru to climb similar to a 582 I pitched the prop for 3300 RPM climb which gave high fuel burn at cruise.

Compared to a 582, the Jabiru not having a radiator and gear box is a plus and so is the ultra smooth idle.

I had zero cooling problems like the original owner because I used the Australian Skyfox cowl (looks like an Avid cowl) and ram air ducts.

My Model 1 Kitfox was powered by a Rotax 532 A box and Ivoprop the first 14 years with excellent performance, handling and reliability.

The 532 would climb to 12000 feet easily and the Jabiru struggled to get to 9000 feet.

This would have improved with a HACman but the 532 did not have mixture control either.

I could seriously erode a wooden Tennessee prop in an afternoon of flying off sand and gravel where as the IVO prop seems to hold up much better.

The Sensenich composite ground adjust prop is a great option other than cost and more importantly the added weight.

The Jabiru requires a bigger battery and V-8 sized battery cables to get started when cold.

Once warmed up, the Jabiru starts instantly.

My Model 1 Kitfox (484 pounds with 532) did not like the added 20 pounds over the 532.

As mentioned on other threads these airplanes like rearword CG's and the Jabiru moved the CG forward and well within the CG range, but the backcountry flying characteristics suffered.

The 532 did not require a rudder trim tab but the Jabiru did.

I decided to go back to a 582 in anticipation of ending up with a 670 for even better climb and possibly better fuel burn at the same cruise speeds as a 582.

So what have I learned.

I cannot stand a 582 without a clutch so add 4 pounds and $500.

The 532 with a snowmobile ignition idles much smoother than a 582.

The Jabiru does not have gear box chatter at low RPM's

The C-box weighs 9 pounds more than an A box and an IVO inflight adjust adds another 3-4 pounds so that now a 582 weighs the same as a Jabiru.

I would like to go with a 670 when it has a track record and someone comes up with a readily available exhaust that fits inside the Kitfox cowl.

The 670 engine will add 10 more pounds and the 670 exhaust another 4-5.

Those of us with the older Avids and Kitfoxes with lower gross weights and shorter fuselages need to be careful about added weight.

It is easy to turn these planes into single seaters especially with 912's and Subaru's

I plan to go with a larger tail wheel and possible move the battery back to regain the former 532 flying qualities.

There is not a clear cut solution.

Herman