Unrecognized Stall

6 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

I had an experience a couple of days ago during a SAR. I was flying from the tight seat in a friends KF slow flight, MCR, making a left turn into the gusty  squirrelly wind. Low and slow.  The bottom line is two experienced pilots did not recognize the stall, both of us suspected a control failure.  Fortunately I relinquished control to the other pilot (over 17K hours) responded properly before we crashed.  
 

The FAA current policy of training based on recovery at the first sign of a stall and no spin training is flawed IMO.  I’m suggesting that more training of recovery and recognition of primary and secondary stalls to be considered for all pilots.

if you experience what seems to be a control failure think stall/spin, stop the rotation with the rudder, full throttle ,stick forward to break the stall, and neutral ailerons. The bottom line is these planes will stall and spin in a heartbeat.

As far as the SAR we had just found the victim floating dead in the canal.  He had tried to rescue his dog from the large canal just ahead of the siphon and was sucked into the siphon and was caught there for at least a day and a half.  This is a very common situation of people trying to rescue a pet from a canal or river.  Please let the pet go should be the first thought but must be a trained response..

ok I’m off my soapbox, just hope this sharing can save someone else.

PS I’m not a CFI so discussion with your CFI is probably the way to go.  The other pilot was a CFI.

Edited by wypaul
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Posted

Yep, I know that I am most vulnerable when I'm focused out the window at something...

I find my airspeed is out of range and often times so is the ball..   perfect setup.

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Posted


sounds like a "moose" stall.  Kills a lot of people.  When I am yanking and banking hard its a pretty good bet that I have the throttle pushed in all the way. 

My instructor HAMMERED me on these "accelerated and uncoordinated" stalls and they always end with a spin.  Depending on if you are slipping or skidding you will either turn turtle and spin opposite of the bank, or just spin with the bank, either way it normally happens really fast!  Glad we are reading about it here and not in an NTSB report as a probable cause.

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Posted


My tail wheel teething was done in a Citabria... No flaps and a worn out motor...Hot summers in Louisiana. My instructor said do a power on stall... It never broke. I was just holding it there using all of the control surfaces... He screamed, "You have it stalled, WTF are  you doing?" 

I was used to 150s and 152s... They would break... And you'd  roll over....

What are the 3 rules? Airspeed, fuel, and fuel?

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Posted

Just a little update this stall happened in a Kitfox IV. With my Avid I cannot produce the stall but with the KF it is easy to make it stall by approaching the stall with flaps on and then pulling them off causing the stall.  My Avid will not do that.  Combination of the different wing and flaperon I suspect.

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Posted

bumping this one back up to the top.

It seems like most these days are scared of stalls and try to not get into them.  I think the first flight in any new plane should be a full regiment of stalls at altitude so you learn houw each planes flys.  I have flown enough different planes of each flavor to know that there are SO many variables that you can't trust a "book" with published speeds.  AS indicators ae notoriously unreliable especially on the lower end.  Planes have been wreck and rebuilt and often the rigging is out of wack.  There might be mods done that will let the plane fly slower than another of the same type etc.  Bottom line is its extremely important to know your airplane.  It should not be an issue if you take off and find your AS indicator is sitting on zero because you have ice in the line.  You should know your approximate speed based on RPM and your ass should tell you all you need to know on the lower end (are the controls mushy etc).  Stalls are fun and I practice them often just for giggles.  Low and slow is not the place to find out about control reversal either!

:BC:

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