Classic IV Restoration

453 posts in this topic

Posted

Excellent work!  I especially like your tail upgrades!

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Posted

Okay.  It's cooling off, winter's coming again and the flying weather is questionable.  Back to work on the Mangy Fox!

 

My accomplishment for today is a new firewall.  The original firewall was, first off, a mess.  It looked terrible and was so full of holes, it should have been called a fire screen.  Second, since I reworked the rudder peddles into something functional, they wouldn't fit in the footwells.  So a new one was definitely in order.

 

 

post-36-0-45708300-1412451272_thumb.jpg

 

post-36-0-32610000-1412451278_thumb.jpg

 

 

More to come...

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Posted

Nice sheet metal work Larry. I'm looking forward to more updates on this one.

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Posted (edited)

Larry,  

      Keep posting as you do firewall flanges / brackets / seals.   I have to do this someday.  did you use stainless?  What is difference in the two or three types that spruce sells - think one of them is "half-hard"??? 

I have planned to bend the flange around my firewall, but brackets might be simpler.

      Innovative work you did on brake/rudder pedal extensions - got to move mine too.

EdMO

Edited by Ed In Missouri

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Posted (edited)

Rudder peddles: in the photo above they are just flopped over to rearward, nothing fancy. See the earlier post in this thread for details on them.

Firewall: it is stainless, six pieces, riveted together. The material was sourced from a local steel house.

I don't understand the othe question on bending the flange versus brackets?

Edited by Av8r3400

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Posted

Larry,

      Referring to my question:   Some builders cut the firewall an inch or so oversize and bend the outside to about 90 degrees to make a flange to connect the cowl to, and to put some kind of material for a cowl seal - others just rivet small brackets there to do the same job.   It looked like yours may be either way at this stage.

EDMO 

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Posted

On my Avid C/D? model , the cowl fits over the top of the firewall. There is some sealing material (Actually looks like a 'soaker hose' with the side slit open) on top of the firewall.  There are only 6 camlocs that connect the cowl to the airframe.  There are a boatload of camlocs that connect the top and bottom cowl to each other.

Mark

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Posted

I'm planning on using a strip of baffle sealing silicone material to seal the firewall to the cowl.

My flying plane has the insulating pocket over the firewall with the seam making the seal to the cowl. I don't care for this because of the cushioned firewall being a pain to clean and possible absorbing a fuel leak causing fire.

I will put insulation on the inside of this firewall keeping the engine side bare metal.

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Posted

My KF 1 and 2 had that insulation on the engine side of the firewall - It soon became an oily mess.  I will just have a plain stainless firewall, and if I add any sound-deadening material it will be on the cabin side.

Some guy showed me a fancy firewall once - he took steel wool packed in an empty shotgun shell, chucked it up in a drill press, and spent hours making the polished stainless firewall look like it had been made on a big milling machine - called it engine-turning, and was very proud of his work - I failed to see any beauty or function!

Another guy who built a Kitfox 5, was very proud of his "engine-turned" IP and the shiny "engine-turned" panels he put on the butt ribs, which were polished enough to blind you on a cloudy day - I again smiled and kept my disgust to myself!

If you have such surfaces on your plane, please don't let me offend you - the sun will send you a message soon enough!   :lol:

EdMO 

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Posted

My flying plane has a yellow panel. Very pretty and very glare-y, too. I'm a big fan of flat or satin black on the panel.

As to insulation, I like the idea of a thin layer on the inside (cabin side) of the firewall and have made accommodation for this.

A good example of "engine turning" is the nose of "The Spirit of St. Louis", Charles Lindbergh's plane. Yeah, probably not going to do that either...

http://www.jpbellphotography.com/images/large/SpiritOfSt.LouisLIT77B&W.jpg

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Posted

It's been nearly a month since the last post on my Mangy Fox rebuild.  

 

I am still working on the plane, just nothing real sexy to show, I've been doing the radiator plumbing, fuel plumbing and, of course, waiting on parts...

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Posted

Larry,

      Are you going to use the rad scoop that Kitfox makes?

EDMO

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Posted

No.  I'm going to try with a "naked" radiator under the plane in a near oem location.  (Same front to rear location, but centered side to side.)  I have - as with most of my other modifications - added threaded tabs to the airframe to mount the radiator instead of the herky-jerk long screws through the floorboards, OEM mount style.

 

If I have cooling issues, I will make my own scoop from aluminum.  I have the fiberglass scoop on my yellow plane and absolutely hate it.  It attaches under the floor of the plane and is near impossible to R/R it.  Therefore I have never taken it off.  I have also, therefore, never done a full flush of the coolant.

 

My project plane will have a plug put in the radiator to facilitate draining the coolant.  If a scoop is needed, I will make it so that the radiator is still serviceable.

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Posted

I've been plugging along with the mangy fox. We brought the plane back down to the machine shop to finish up the fuselage where the welders are due to the snow. I'm hoping to wrap up the fuselage before the end of the year and get it sand blasted and re-powder-coated. (A better color than babyshit blue)

Here's the latest little tidbit. The main fuel shutoff. He control is on the panel with a driveshaft (and u-joint) going to the valve body on the firewall. Also note the duel fan heater core.

post-36-0-42058800-1416534753_thumb.jpg

post-36-0-38038300-1416534774_thumb.jpg

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Posted

I'm kind of wondering about the benefits or lack thereof in using a radiator for cabin heat versus a muffler shroud. I never have had a radiator system, but have made a muffler shroud on a 582, and a Jabiru that worked very well. My thoughts are like this. The colder it gets, the more you need the heat. The colder it gets, the less excess heat the engine will produce for the radiator. As long as the engine is running, the muffler will be hot, whatever the outside temp. Not trying to start an argument, just trying to stimulate a discussion that I can learn from. Like I said, I've never used a radiator system, and want to know if they would be better than the shroud. Thanks, Jim Chuk

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Posted

I have a thermostat downstream of the heater core. This will eliminate the outside radiator from the loop if it's too cold outside. Plus realistically speaking I don't fly if it's much below 10-15 degrees f. I have near an identical system, less the thermostat in my yellow plane and it works very well. Plus, if it works in your car, why not in the plane.

I don't care for exhaust system heating due to the possibility do exhaust influx. It's just kinda my hang up.

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Posted (edited)

I had a case of CO poisoning once - Went to hospital and spent a long time with them taking blood samples out of veins deep in my wrist every 30 minutes for what seemed like hours - hurt like hell - spent the night on oxygen - the bill was about $3000, and that was 30 years ago...I am not going thru that again, so will use a hot-water heater even if it weighs 13 pounds.

What kind of rad and fans did you use, and how much weight - any defroster setup?

EdMO

Edited by Ed In Missouri

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Posted

I've never seen a fuel shutoff mounted on the panel.  Good out of the box thinking!  Out to make flow checks a bit easier.

 

Also, excuse my ignorance, but how do you powdercoat over powdercoat?

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Posted

@ Ed - The Radiator (heater core) is a Earl's Cooler core sized at 5 x 13", the two fans were on the Mangy Fox original setup with two small radiators.  They are approximately 4-1/2" diameter computer box fans.  I don't have an exact weight on the assembly, but I'd estimate it at 4 pounds.

 

@Paul - The first step in the process is sandblasting.  Then fresh powder is applied.

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Posted (edited)

Here's some plumbing fab work that got done today.  I'm trying to maximize the amount of hard piping rather than hose in the coolant system.  We pieced several pipes together and also welded in nipples for the heater hoses to the heater core.

 

 

Here's the left (pilot) side piping.

 

post-36-0-30888000-1416711455_thumb.jpg

 

A lower view, showing the thermostat housing.

 

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Here's the right side.  I'm not quite done with this one, yet.  I want to shorten the hose to the water pump more...

 

post-36-0-57574700-1416711492_thumb.jpg

 

post-36-0-44468400-1416711473_thumb.jpg

Edited by Av8r3400
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Posted

Larry,

Where did you get the thermostat housing, and what temperature is it? is it set for the engine or for the heater?

EDMO

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Posted

Housing and thermostat came from Highwing LLC.  180º.

 

http://highwingllc.com/thermostat.html

 

I have it positioned so that water constantly can go through the heater core, but the thermostat keeps it from the belly radiator.

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Posted

Does the thermostat have a weep hole to give some circulation when it's closed? I'm trying to understand how it will function with the long dead leg to heat in order to open.

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Posted

Yes there's a small weep hole in it.

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Posted

I'm planning a ball valve also in the right side leg of the heater line, where I have a longer line and room to place it. This will help open the thermostat in the warmer times of the year.

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