Making engine mount for phaser

31 posts in this topic

Posted

Ive changed directions and purchased a phaser snowmobile. Have been reasearching building the mount. They all seam to have the engine on an angle. The actual building of it I'm confident how do you determine where and at what angle to build into the mount?

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Posted (edited)

This is for a KF1 right?

I thought I heard that the early model Kitfoxes had a built in angle on the firewall?   You should be able to detect it (if it is there) by measuring back to the airframe.

Otherwise need to know which direction your prop turns.  Some people will angle about 2 to 4 degrees left for a left turning prop and opposite for a right.  That to counter P factor.

Some people say they mount zero angle and shim the mount later if they need to.

Edited by Yamma-Fox

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Posted

I measured the thrust angles of the 582 on my model II before I removed it. 0 degree left to right, 1 degree up from perpendicular to the firewall. Moving the thrust line up or down can also effect flight characteristics, I plan to keep the same thrust line as the 582.

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Posted

Shiming it sounds like a good way to go if your not happy with the angles its alot easier to change than building a new on does anybody have some photos of a completed one? And uea it will be going on a 1, brought it home yesterday.

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Posted (edited)

Here are pics of the one I made for my 4 cyl RX-1.  It is based off of several other examples of successful Yamaha mounts by other people.

The extra cross member on front left is for my oil tank and I needed to canteliver the right support that goes to the bottom mount location in order to clear the crankcase. 

Angles should be easier on your short 2 cyl Phazer and you wont have to stretch out so far so it should be a cinch.

20181001_115023.jpg

20181001_185428.jpg

20181001_185653.jpg

Edited by Yamma-Fox
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Posted

Good looking engine!! :)

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Posted

What are the specs on the tubing you used?

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Posted

Mostly all .049 x .75

Mount locations are .75 x .059 with brass bushings for the smaller dia bolts.  I did it that way to allow for some warpage and still get er to bolt up.

Big side tubes are 1.5"

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Posted

I have some 1 1/4 .049 I was thinking about using for the main tubes & 1/2 .049 for everything else. Not sure if that’s heavy enough wall for the side tubes.

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Posted

With the lightweight phazer and less cantilever distance id bet that would do fine.  But I might upsize it since i like to overbuild things ;)

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Posted

Looking at the pics looks like your using a mowhawk adapter, can you give us a report on it and where did the harnes come from?

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Posted (edited)

Not sure if you mean my pics?

If so then no I'd never use a Mohawk ANYTHING.  Mine is a Skytrax with C box.

I was friends with Greg at Mohawk early on but have unfortunately gravitated entirely away anything he does.

Biggest reason:  He builds prortotypes, posts videos of them and advertises them as the next greatest thing...  without testing / proving them / working out any issues with them.

Greg leaves the testing and R&D up to his customers.  That is fine if he were upfront about it because then you could decide if you wanted to be the test pilot of his engineering.  But he is most definitely not upfront about it!  Quite the contrary.

 

Edited by Yamma-Fox
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Posted

 Anything new on the Phazer development?

IMG_0903.JPG

IMG_0904.JPG

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Posted

 Anything new on the Phazer development?

 

 

Teal is hoping to have a prototype gearbox out this spring for testing.  It will be a design similar to his Skytrax Apex gearbox-adapter  (all in one) that replaces the end housing on the engine.

Otherwise "72chevy" here in this group has everyone beat with his prototype running a c box and pulling how much thrust at what weight again Duke?

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Posted

I was getting around 365lbs thrust with my 66 inch three blade gsc. I now have a 68 inch three blade luga to test. I had the phazer motor off the test stand to fit it to my kitfox and fab the motor mount. I’m hoping to get it back on the test stand soon and try out this new prop and also develop and test the intake for the kitfox.

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Posted

The total weight on that screenshot may be a bit optimistic but probably not far off.

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Posted

I was getting around 365lbs thrust with my 66 inch three blade gsc. I now have a 68 inch three blade luga to test. I had the phazer motor off the test stand to fit it to my kitfox and fab the motor mount. I’m hoping to get it back on the test stand soon and try out this new prop and also develop and test the intake for the kitfox.

What rpm were you turning to get the 365 lbs of thrust? JImChuk

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Posted

I pitched the prop to limit engine rpm to 11,200,  the dyno charts I have for the phazer show peak power at this rpm.  Prop rpm would be about 2250.

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Posted

Still hard for me to wrap my mind around rpms that high.  JImChuk

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Posted (edited)

Still hard for me to wrap my mind around rpms that high.  JImChuk

Sometime here you need to get some stick time behind one Jim!  Mine only rapps out about 9k so that will be a good 1st step initiation ;)

FWIW the Phazer ecu rev limiter is up around 12k and many sport bikes (of the same engine class) are up N of 15k.  They're made to do it! 

Edited by Yamma-Fox
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Posted

Yes, I understand the engines are made for it, but it just doesn't seem natural.  Kind of like a continental or Lycoming guy all of a sudden running a 912 at 5500 rpm.  It's just not going to seem right to him.  And yet they will do it all day long.... JImChuk

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Posted (edited)

IMG_1516.MOV

Edited by 72chevy
Didn’t work

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Posted

Boy im thinking im hooked on the 2cyl yamaha conversion also instead of the 617/670 rotax swap when the time comes, by then the bugs will b all worked out, but we all better buy up the yamaha motors b4 the prices on them SKYROCKET.  

Spring is coming and the prices will b down durring summer. 

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Posted

Buying during the off season is the way to go for sure, I picked my phazer up for $1600 and sold $600 of salvage off it.  I would say the risk of aviation effecting the market or supply of these machines would be marginal at best.

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Posted

Buying during the off season is the way to go for sure, I picked my phazer up for $1600 and sold $600 of salvage off it.  I would say the risk of aviation effecting the market or supply of these machines would be marginal at best.

Agreed.  At most there might be a few hundred Phazer conversions in the next couple years.  There are many thousands of sleds out there.

IMO The bigger thing will probably be an oversupply of remnant parts on the market.  Might become difficult to sell the "scraps".

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