Bringing a Kitfox 1 back to life

[Buckchop 479]

The work to get that gear or any wider gear is SUPER worth the work. I hear ull never go back, i still havent been able to taxi mine new gear yet since it got sent back to TN, only been waiting since Aug 9th ill probably get to taxi mine first time on skis in the snow. 

[allonsye 85]

Allonsye,  

his gear is built ok, and strong, very light weight, and good guy to deal with, and $1350 with shipping, ready to bolt on, so i got one set from him, paid in full, he built it to my specs, then sent it ground shipping to me in Ak that takes 17+days, i paid $150 for priority 3-5 day shipping i thought,??  anyways all the center V bolts holes where all crooked/off by half a bolt hole, and the left gearleg was 5/8" shorter than the right,  the springs r suppose to b 6" long so there is preload and the ones in the setup where 5" long so just the plane sitting empty the springs where colapsed 3/4", so had to send it back to him so he could build me a whole new set again.  He said he has no idea how that happened, Now im waiting again for the new second set, hate to say that about that, but it is true, started all this on august 11th and i have pic.  Sorry for that bad news. 

Allonsye,  

his gear is built ok, and strong, very light weight, and good guy to deal with, and $1350 with shipping, ready to bolt on, so i got one set from him, paid in full, he built it to my specs, then sent it ground shipping to me in Ak that takes 17+days, i paid $150 for priority 3-5 day shipping i thought,??  anyways all the center V bolts holes where all crooked/off by half a bolt hole, and the left gearleg was 5/8" shorter than the right,  the springs r suppose to b 6" long so there is preload and the ones in the setup where 5" long so just the plane sitting empty the springs where colapsed 3/4", so had to send it back to him so he could build me a whole new set again.  He said he has no idea how that happened, Now im waiting again for the new second set, hate to say that about that, but it is true, started all this on august 11th and i have pic.  Sorry for that bad news. 

Whoa!..........sorry to hear about this.

Not to hijack the thread, but where are you with your discouraging project?

Paul

[Buckchop 479]

He is rebuilding the gear right now, he says all is going great and im happy about that!!! And he said he have it to me b4 my birthday next month, cant wait to get the gear on.  He is a good guy to deal with and so far stands behind his work. Im just bumbed that it happened, and sucks to wait to fly ur newest bird. Hahahhaaaaaa

[Good old number 29 158]

Thanks for the tip on the Grove brakes, Bucky. That helped me out with all of the issues I had with finding and fitting wheels and brakes for the cub axles. It’s light, and the brakes work great. He gave me a great tip on a guy selling a used Grove disc conversion on 4” Cub wheels with 8.00 x 4” tires. It was a great deal, and solved every problem I was facing with the McCauleys or the old Cub brakes. I haven’t put the 26” Air Wheels on these rims, yet, but it probably won’t be long. 

 

[Buckchop 479]

Man that is AWESOME!!! Glad to helpout!! Looks damm good to.

[Good old number 29 158]

I didn't like the idea of replacing a bolt every fifty hours because it might break, so I fixed the elevator idler bellcrank mount with a piece of 1/4" tubing and some .125" plate. Now the bolt is properly supported on both sides. I also gusseted the rudder pedals and shortened the master cylinder rods to get better brake pedal geometry. It's at 1-1/8" to 2-1/2", measured to the center of the brake pedal tube. Matco recommends a 1:2.5 ratio on the pedal. I'd say they got it right. The brakes lock up tight with finger pressure, and I'm not standing on the brakes when I turn the rudder. The pedals have 3/4" travel.

Edited 3 Nov 2019 by Good old number 29
Correction

[dholly 718]

Good moves. I would suggest a gusset or strap at the rudder pedal to rudder cable horn as well. Mine let go on landing, thankfully kept control but the seat cushion was ruined.

[Good old number 29 158]

Thank you, Sir. I’ve taken your advice, and have added some small gussets of .050”, that will help with the pull. 

[Good old number 29 158]

Wheel and tire comparison. Note that the ground is uneven  

Goodyear 8.00-4

McCreary 8.00-6

Nanco 21x12.00-8

Goodyear 26x11-4

I’ll be using one or both pairs of Goodyears.

[akflyer 1427]

just a heads up... I have run lots of different tires on mine.  The good years are pretty heavy and don't offer much cushion on our light birds.  Out of the line up you have, I would be running the nancos.  

[Good old number 29 158]

I wish I had some lightweight 8” wheels and the right brakes to make that happen. The Nancos are on the Kitfox wheels and hub that uses a 3/4” axle. The reason I planned on using the Goodyear tires is because both pairs will work with my 1-1/4” Piper axles and Grove brakes. I weighed each tire, wheel, and brake. Here is how that shook out:

8.00-4 w/ Grove disc: 16.5 lb

8.00-6 w/ McCauley disc: 19 lb

21x12-8 with Kitfox disc: 18 lb

26x11-4 with Goodrich drum: 29.5 lb

I should note that the drum is clearly lighter than the Grove or McCauley discs, and that it’s on the same style wheels as the ones the Grove brakes are on. The Kitfox disc is probably close, but still heavier. Also, the expander brakes were useless to me. All of the tires are four ply, except the Nanco, which is two. 

I’ve been leaning toward using the 8.00-4’s, which are the smallest, lightest ones. They definitely don’t offer much cushion, but the simple fact of being a bolt on solution, that is 25 pounds lighter than the bigger tires, makes it more palatable. The guy I bought it from had another, smaller pair of original tires. I forget the exact size and manufacturer. I did throw them away because I didn’t like the checking. The thing is, when I bought it, he told me that it handled better with the smaller tires. I don’t know if he was taking off on pavement. The three pounds of weight that I lose, switching down from the Nancos, might help balance out the added weight if the heavier landing gear. I’m giving the legs some polyester pants, then I’ll think about weighing it again. I could still use the 6” wheels, but those calipers are also heavier, plus it uses the axle adapters. 

[Good old number 29 158]

The original wheels on this are the 8” atv wheels with a five lug bolt pattern on the bolt-on hub. The brake rotor is attached to the back of the hub, on the end, with allen screws, and it used the Air Heart calipers and Matco master cylinders. It’s not the disc that mounts to the lugs welded on the wheel. It might be possible to find another hub with 1-1/4 i.d. bearings, and that fits the bolt pattern on the wheels, but you’d still have to make torque plates for the calipers, trim the inside diameter of the disc so it would fit over the bearing stops, and drill and tap the hub to attach it. The biggest difficulty with my wide gear has been finding a good set of wheels, tires, and brakes that I’m happy with. Funny, because it’s the most common axle you’ll find this side of a 172. I’m just picky, I guess. It has to be huge, but it can’t weigh anything. The brakes have to stop it on a dime at double gross, and it has to bolt itself on. 

[akflyer 1427]

I have struggled with this myself.  Matco make wheels for the 1.25" axles that will bolt right up.  You can also look at the desser tires that will go on standard 6" wheels. or the 27" dessers that will matco makes an 8" wheel for.  

 

[Good old number 29 158]

[Good old number 29 158]

I might as well be the one to point out that these tires make it look like a cartoon dog with a giant head and a tiny body. 

[Good old number 29 158]

Before and after the wide gear. 

[Brodstol 41]

Ooo very nice, makes we want to get cabanes on my model 1

 

[Good old number 29 158]

It was a beautiful day to pass the condition inspection. We just got the first snow of the season, yesterday. I love the fresh snow on the ground, but it did make a bit of a mess, towing the plane backwards. I still need bungee covers, so I taped a bag over them for travel. A friend introduced me to an A&P/IA in Kenai who did the inspection and also helped mount up those 25” Goodyears. Paul Buckel - 412-1505, if you are in the area. He gave me a good deal on the inspection, and was easy to work with. 

[Good old number 29 158]

Good old number 29 has come a long way since she was ordered on June 25, 1985, for $9,290.12, plus shipping. Now airworthy and legal for the first time since 2011. Here are the original purchase documents and some pictures with the builder. Notice the cog belt pulley instead of the gearbox. Yes, she’s come a long way. 

[Buckchop 479]

Right on man thats awesome, u r farther than i am since waiting on some landing gear, ( which he sent slowboat to china, AGAIN!!!!) (after we had a discussion about sending it out 3-5 days the day b4 he sent it out) 

well now all u need is some flying time huh? Mine had one of those cogbelts on it earlie in life also, dont think it lasted 10hrs b4 was changed a gearbox. 

[Good old number 29 158]

Yes, I’m still waiting to get some flight time. I talked to one instructor who came highly recommended and has some Kitfox time. He required carb heat, which I haven’t done. I’m considering it. Not likely to fly until next week, between the weather and other things I have going on. 

[1avidflyer 1983]

Good article by Mike Stratman in Proper Care of Rotax engines series about rotax and bing carbs and the need or lack thereof for carb heat.  Hopefully, here is the link to it.  If the link doesn't work, it's Part # 44.  JImChuk

https://www.cps-parts.com/cps/pdf/Part44.pdf
 

[Good old number 29 158]

Thanks, Jim. I have the article, and I did read it again. I didn’t think I’d get anywhere arguing those points with this particular guy. He said he didn’t care if everybody says the engine doesn’t need it, it does. And, if I don’t believe him, ask David Goode. Well, I don’t know him, so I looked up his name and found it in the database. Looks like he had two different Avids; an Avid Flyer Mk IV, listed as a Light Aero, and one listed as an Airdale, which has a Subaru. Here is the report on the destruction of the Mk. 4. No mention of icing or what engine was on it. This instructor said he has fifty years of experience. It might be worth putting the carb heat on, just to catch a bit of what he’s learned. He was highly recommended by an A&P friend with over 30k hours. 

[akflyer 1427]

sounds like you talked to Pierce.  Daves was not carb ice.. Dave also wrecked every plane he ever flew.  If Pierce won't fly with ya I can probably find another instructor for you, even if I have to give them some time in my avid.  Pierce was my initial flight instructor many moons ago and is a good guy, but he can be a bit hard headed.  

 

[Buckchop 479]

Y the heck do u need carbheat on a two stroke? Ur not out bombing around in the snowbanks, i know temp at altitude is something to deal with, but i dont think id install it on mine after more lookin into it.  And someone told me wasnt needed, 

BUT thats just My Opinion. And that articale has nothing to do with crashing from carb ice problem does it? Or did i miss something.